Those running flex fuel get in here :)

[Bboyd]

great info! give another direction!!!

 

[BULL]

Are the various race fuel grades E90 or E95?

Do you think you have enough headroom for that?

 

[Speedy!]

Ignite makes an E90 and an E98 that a lot of people use and Renegade makes E98 and a leaded E112. I could maybe get away with the E90, but would probably have to run the injectors at 100% (or more) for E98. That's going past what my intentions are here. I plan to stick with Renegade RM109 for the track and just play with this flex fuel for the street. I may ask Mike if there's any benefit to mixing RM109 and pump E85 to maybe an E60 race fuel blend, but that'd mean a lot of measuring and the last thing I need is more "process" at the track.

 

[FFBOS]

Pump e85 in the summer is good enough. True “e80-83”. Time to pulley down Speedy....add that 10% lower and never look back. FIC1200 or ID1300

 

[Speedy!]

LOL bad influence @FFBOS

 

[fubar569]

I mean he ain't wrong tho.

Once the E hits a solid 75+ I drop right to the 2.50 and send it.

 

[Speedy!]

Honestly it's more than I want to get in to. $1800 for injectors and $500 for the lower. I'm good where it's at. I may end up at or near my race tune on this pump E85 and that's been good for 9.80s. I only need 10.0s for the classes I'm interested in. The rest is just gravy.

I may check out a larger throttle body at some point though.

 

[FFBOS]

Honestly it's more than I want to get in to. $1800 for injectors and $500 for the lower. I'm good where it's at. I may end up at or near my race tune on this pump E85 and that's been good for 9.80s. I only need 10.0s for the classes I'm interested in. The rest is just gravy.

Once you go there, you won’t go back and you will never put 93 in the car again for throttle purposes lol.

Most of the parts I’ve acquired for my car were used. ATI Lowers are all over. New in box and used for great deals. Injectors as well. Think I got my 1300’s for under $1k

 

[Speedy!]

That's a good deal!

 

[fubar569]

Since I'm with the curtsauce...he uses FIC1200's which were installed by OST.

I know some wont use anything but ID but in my experience with them I can't tell a difference. I'm sure there is however.. wherever it may be...

I also know that with dual 285's the 1200's have been extremely solid all the way down to the 2.50 with a little room to spare. Essentially they're about a perfect match for the dual pump system...as once you outgrow one or the other...its time for a return style system and BIG boy injectors anyways.

 

[MaxCarnage]

Great data Speedy!

Gives me more things to think about. I don't have E85 off the pump here, but I have two different options for getting it delivered by the barrel. Just trying to weigh the flaws of E85 vs Q16, given what I have access to. If E85 was off the pump here, I'd be a lot more apt to do it. Like you my goals are 10.0. My Redeye is pretty close to that already. So I'm going to either run stock injectors with 93/Q16 (Track only) with a 3.17 Hellraiser or E85 (stock pulley) with 1200/1300 injectors and a FF tune (with perhaps a E85 track only tune), both setups catless. I'm jealous of you all that have easy and cheap access to E85. Apparently we hate E85 here in the NW.

 

[Speedy!]

The issue with E85 in barrels is storage I think. Ethanol is hygroscopic and readily absorbs water from the air, and anywhere else, so you'll want to check in to that as far as keeping it sealed up and what not. Renegade's racing E85 was like $300 a barrel last I checked, so still pretty good value considering if it'll keep.

 

[MaxCarnage]

The issue with E85 in barrels is storage I think. Ethanol is hygroscopic and readily absorbs water from the air, and anywhere else, so you'll want to check in to that as far as keeping it sealed up and what not. Renegade's racing E85 was like $300 a barrel last I checked, so still pretty good value considering if it'll keep.

Last I was told from my source was it can last up to a year in the barrel as long as it's kept sealed. I think only a month in a gas tank though. Once I get more serious about it, I'll double check my options. It's definitely cheaper than race gas though even by the barrel.

 

[Scott]

Ok ran some good logs to get what I think is the final test on the ID1000 injectors, dual pumps, and full E85.

Ambient temp was about 55 deg F, car made 17.5psi, aircharge 1800+ (good air), log read 86% alcohol. Inj DC never went over 82%, fuel pump DC 78%, and 80psi fuel pressure at 6500 RPM. In 30 degree air I might see another 5% give or take, so I'm approaching the limit of these injectors, but they're not at, or over, the limit so good news I can save a few bucks and not have to buy more injectors as long as I stay with just the 2.72 upper pulley.

So with this test the alcohol content has a lot more to do with the injector DC than the actual air or air temp from what I found. My testing had the following results on the ID1000s. The newer version of these is the 1050x and I think flow about 5% more fuel on top of what I'm getting on these 1000s so people with those will be in even better shape, especially if you're on a 2.85 pulley. You will definitely need the dual pumps though.

E57 - 70% DC and +3 deg timing over 93
E78 - 75% DC and +5 deg timing over 93
E86 - 82% DC and +5 deg timing over 93 (so far not sure if we'll add more or not)

Would the stock redeye pumps work/keep up to your setup and the way your testing?

 

[fubar569]

I believe that most will end up needing a BAP on E85 and they will need injectors regardless.

 

[Blkout]

Since I'm with the curtsauce...he uses FIC1200's which were installed by OST.

I know some wont use anything but ID but in my experience with them I can't tell a difference. I'm sure there is however.. wherever it may be...

I also know that with dual 285's the 1200's have been extremely solid all the way down to the 2.50 with a little room to spare. Essentially they're about a perfect match for the dual pump system...as once you outgrow one or the other...its time for a return style system and BIG boy injectors anyways.

I have ID1300x2's which were very expensive, I don't think the FIC 1200s were out when I got mine. If I were buying injectors today, it would be FIC 1200s, can't beat them for the same price or less as ID1050s.

 

[Blkout]

Honestly it's more than I want to get in to. $1800 for injectors and $500 for the lower. I'm good where it's at. I may end up at or near my race tune on this pump E85 and that's been good for 9.80s. I only need 10.0s for the classes I'm interested in. The rest is just gravy.

I may check out a larger throttle body at some point though.

Hard to beat the BBK 100mm for 599. I haven't seen any benefit in a 105mm on most builds and its typically $200-300 more. Not much benefit in a larger TB until you have a ported snout.

 

[coolblue]

I may check out a larger throttle body at some point though.[/QUOTE]

Agree with that. With all the fuel and air flow (i.e. pulley swaps) improvements I'm surprised more guys with these mods aren't making that change.(price?). Imo at these levels there has to be a gain.

 

[CodyK]

This is from the station right by my house. I just really don’t want to pay for the dual pump

 

[Speedy!]

Looks just like mine.